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weinstein - the open secret
   
solaris
10/11/2017     
Member the reason this guy has got away with so much for so long is the silence of others

names like paltrow, jolie, kendall ... WHEN will women learn that these abusers manage to operate for decades because not enough speak out and break the silence? i get that he probably targeted them when they were newer actresses, trying to make their name, and he manipulated them; but they've been powerful names in the industry for years - they SHOULD have spoken out. does this excuse weinstein? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!! just makes me sad how women take on the shame, carry the secret. it enables the predators. Sick
Post #1040086 Back to top ▲
10/11/2017
  
solaris
Member
the reason this guy has got away with so much for so long is the silence of others

names like paltrow, jolie, kendall ... WHEN will women learn that these abusers manage to operate for decades because not enough speak out and break the silence? i get that he probably targeted them when they were newer actresses, trying to make their name, and he manipulated them; but they've been powerful names in the industry for years - they SHOULD have spoken out. does this excuse weinstein? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!! just makes me sad how women take on the shame, carry the secret. it enables the predators. Sick
Post #1040086
grace
10/12/2017     
Lifetime Member So you're blaming the victims?

Pretty sure that women know they should speak up and break the silence, but then, with the power differential in this particular case, and all that the ladies had to lose... it's very easy to say what they should have done.
Post #1040091 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
grace
Lifetime Member
So you're blaming the victims?

Pretty sure that women know they should speak up and break the silence, but then, with the power differential in this particular case, and all that the ladies had to lose... it's very easy to say what they should have done.
Post #1040091
solaris
10/12/2017     
Member let me be clear - there were people who knew what was going on who were not victims, and there were those who'd been victimised but had gone on to be super famous, wealthy women whose voices WOULD have been listened to, or would have at least made a huge stir. instead, they did what so many people do (male and female in these situations) and that's to privately warn off others. this doesn't stop the weinstein's of this world from continuing to garner public acclaim, wealth and power and continuing to abuse the more vulnerabale for decades.

predators are able to continue to abuse when no-one speaks out. the young woman who went to her friend 2 years back, and from there with her friend to the police, enabled that voice-recording the police have and that has been played on the news channels. the fact that the authorities didn't proceed with prosecuting the man who is now accused by 3 others of rape as well as the numerous sexual assault charges already being leveled at him bites my arse. apparently there was another celebrity situation not long before that got screwed up and cost them (the authorities) a lot of credibility. HER bravery is a fantastic model. it sickens me that women still have to feel so afraid for their careers, reputations, even their lives, that they take on the abuser's shame and carry it with them - when they should be furious, righteous, and expose the abusers. time's are changing, i'd just hoped they'd changed a little faster given the cosby stuff. dammit, ladies, this can't be allowed to happen.

i actually endured many years of physical abuse from my husband at the time - once i was brave enough, and helped to do so by another family member, to go to the police about it, it put a stop to it. people like him THRIVE on the victim's silence. i don't doubt for one second that someone as wealthy/powerful as weinstein would do anything they could to discredit the witnesses.

Edited: 10/12/2017 by solaris
Post #1040092 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
solaris
Member
let me be clear - there were people who knew what was going on who were not victims, and there were those who'd been victimised but had gone on to be super famous, wealthy women whose voices WOULD have been listened to, or would have at least made a huge stir. instead, they did what so many people do (male and female in these situations) and that's to privately warn off others. this doesn't stop the weinstein's of this world from continuing to garner public acclaim, wealth and power and continuing to abuse the more vulnerabale for decades.

predators are able to continue to abuse when no-one speaks out. the young woman who went to her friend 2 years back, and from there with her friend to the police, enabled that voice-recording the police have and that has been played on the news channels. the fact that the authorities didn't proceed with prosecuting the man who is now accused by 3 others of rape as well as the numerous sexual assault charges already being leveled at him bites my arse. apparently there was another celebrity situation not long before that got screwed up and cost them (the authorities) a lot of credibility. HER bravery is a fantastic model. it sickens me that women still have to feel so afraid for their careers, reputations, even their lives, that they take on the abuser's shame and carry it with them - when they should be furious, righteous, and expose the abusers. time's are changing, i'd just hoped they'd changed a little faster given the cosby stuff. dammit, ladies, this can't be allowed to happen.

i actually endured many years of physical abuse from my husband at the time - once i was brave enough, and helped to do so by another family member, to go to the police about it, it put a stop to it. people like him THRIVE on the victim's silence. i don't doubt for one second that someone as wealthy/powerful as weinstein would do anything they could to discredit the witnesses.

Edited: 10/12/2017 by solaris
Post #1040092
grace
10/12/2017     
Lifetime Member Yes, but apart from Kendall, who I am uncertain as to who she is, you mentioned two victims - Jolie, and Paltrow. How do you know they WOULD have been listened to? Easy to state that now, given that their voices were added to Judd's, McGowan's, and the other anonymous ladies in the first NYT report. Just because they became 'super famous, wealthy women', it became their responsibility to take on Weinstein?
Post #1040093 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
grace
Lifetime Member
Yes, but apart from Kendall, who I am uncertain as to who she is, you mentioned two victims - Jolie, and Paltrow. How do you know they WOULD have been listened to? Easy to state that now, given that their voices were added to Judd's, McGowan's, and the other anonymous ladies in the first NYT report. Just because they became 'super famous, wealthy women', it became their responsibility to take on Weinstein?
Post #1040093
solaris
10/12/2017     
Member
when someone as wealthy and famous as either jolie or paltrow speak out, it causes a stir; that is the nature of fame - you are noticed.
whether or not they would be believed is another matter. very likely not when they were new actresses, struggling young women. if, as famous women, they had taken a stand, it would almost undoubtedly have given others the courage to speak out. if individuals do not accept responsibility, nothing changes. i applaud wholeheartedly the fact they are speaking out now. i am not attacking them, just voicing my frustration that they didn't speak out before.

no one's saying it's easy. it was the hardest thing i'd ever done in my life at the time. nowadays, having been out of that toxic relationship for over a decade, i wish i'd have spoken out earlier. the wrong lay with him, his actions, and i shouldn't have been a party to protecting him from repercussions. it's because i have learned from this that i not only understand the reluctance of victims to speak out but also that we shouldn't have to feel that way. quite the opposite, in fact. valuing oneself is very important.
Post #1040094 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
solaris
Member

when someone as wealthy and famous as either jolie or paltrow speak out, it causes a stir; that is the nature of fame - you are noticed.
whether or not they would be believed is another matter. very likely not when they were new actresses, struggling young women. if, as famous women, they had taken a stand, it would almost undoubtedly have given others the courage to speak out. if individuals do not accept responsibility, nothing changes. i applaud wholeheartedly the fact they are speaking out now. i am not attacking them, just voicing my frustration that they didn't speak out before.

no one's saying it's easy. it was the hardest thing i'd ever done in my life at the time. nowadays, having been out of that toxic relationship for over a decade, i wish i'd have spoken out earlier. the wrong lay with him, his actions, and i shouldn't have been a party to protecting him from repercussions. it's because i have learned from this that i not only understand the reluctance of victims to speak out but also that we shouldn't have to feel that way. quite the opposite, in fact. valuing oneself is very important.
Post #1040094
Itsmehonest
10/12/2017     
Member

In my case the ‘know I should speak up. Is not so clear. The person who assaulted me was a woman who I believe to be very fragile and in a precarious place in life and who I don’t think is predatory. I feel I was not responsible ( I was drunk 😳and so was vulnerable and I feel I let myself down). And I think I owed myself that duty of care to myself. There are other ... things.

Should I have done, yes. Is it clear cut; I don’t think it always is
Post #1040104 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
Itsmehonest
Member


In my case the ‘know I should speak up. Is not so clear. The person who assaulted me was a woman who I believe to be very fragile and in a precarious place in life and who I don’t think is predatory. I feel I was not responsible ( I was drunk 😳and so was vulnerable and I feel I let myself down). And I think I owed myself that duty of care to myself. There are other ... things.

Should I have done, yes. Is it clear cut; I don’t think it always is
Post #1040104
solaris
10/12/2017     
Member i trust you know i wasn't knocking your situation :rose: that's pretty complex, and alcohol always makes things harder to draw clear lines about during and after the events. Sad
Post #1040105 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
solaris
Member
i trust you know i wasn't knocking your situation :rose: that's pretty complex, and alcohol always makes things harder to draw clear lines about during and after the events. Sad
Post #1040105
Itsmehonest
10/12/2017     
Member I know Solaris 🌹
Post #1040108 Back to top ▲
10/12/2017
  
Itsmehonest
Member
I know Solaris 🌹
Post #1040108
solaris
10/13/2017     
Member we need to change the whole feel about the results of coming forward. i do believe that people not directly assaulted but knowing about it should have reported his damned skanky arse.
if i'd have found the courage and not made mental excuses for his behaviour and reported the psycho 15 years before i did, it would have saved me a shit ton of physical and mental abuse and other women besides me. guess it's because of that, the guilt in not having done so for my own sake and for others, combined with the freedom speaking out brings that makes me such an advocate for shining the spotlight on the scum.

i still think that, when jolie and paltrow and others had the kind of profiles that would allow them to make complaints without fearing they'd 'never work again', and that includes the brad pitts and others in the know, they could have banded together, organised and consolidated and outed him. i'm sure they regret not having done so.

but let's be perfectly clear on this subject: weinstein is the one i am blaming. his actions, his greed, his misuse of power because he could get away with it.
it saddens me that people still don't feel they can come forward to report abusers like him for fear of their own reputations, livelihoods, and personal comfort. it is time to change this. time to be empowered. time to stand up and say 'no, i will NOT keep your dirty secrets and carry YOUR shame. this is YOUR guilt, own it!'
Post #1040125 Back to top ▲
10/13/2017
  
solaris
Member
we need to change the whole feel about the results of coming forward. i do believe that people not directly assaulted but knowing about it should have reported his damned skanky arse.
if i'd have found the courage and not made mental excuses for his behaviour and reported the psycho 15 years before i did, it would have saved me a shit ton of physical and mental abuse and other women besides me. guess it's because of that, the guilt in not having done so for my own sake and for others, combined with the freedom speaking out brings that makes me such an advocate for shining the spotlight on the scum.

i still think that, when jolie and paltrow and others had the kind of profiles that would allow them to make complaints without fearing they'd 'never work again', and that includes the brad pitts and others in the know, they could have banded together, organised and consolidated and outed him. i'm sure they regret not having done so.

but let's be perfectly clear on this subject: weinstein is the one i am blaming. his actions, his greed, his misuse of power because he could get away with it.
it saddens me that people still don't feel they can come forward to report abusers like him for fear of their own reputations, livelihoods, and personal comfort. it is time to change this. time to be empowered. time to stand up and say 'no, i will NOT keep your dirty secrets and carry YOUR shame. this is YOUR guilt, own it!'
Post #1040125
Itsmehonest
10/13/2017     
Member I am about six months post my assault. I talked to an attorney a couple of weeks ago and decided not to report it. It’s too long ago. It would be my word against hers. My guess is that nothing good would come of it and that I have gone through stuff that is more upsetting to me since ( not illegal just upsetting life stuff).

I’m interested I guess to know if others feel that’s the wrong decision? Where there is NO evidence whatsoever and it would come down to word against word six months later?

Neither party denies sex but the perpetrator denies it
Being unwanted or pressure ( in fact tried to blame me even though I was asleep when the sex started)
Post #1040133 Back to top ▲
10/13/2017
  
Itsmehonest
Member
I am about six months post my assault. I talked to an attorney a couple of weeks ago and decided not to report it. It’s too long ago. It would be my word against hers. My guess is that nothing good would come of it and that I have gone through stuff that is more upsetting to me since ( not illegal just upsetting life stuff).

I’m interested I guess to know if others feel that’s the wrong decision? Where there is NO evidence whatsoever and it would come down to word against word six months later?

Neither party denies sex but the perpetrator denies it
Being unwanted or pressure ( in fact tried to blame me even though I was asleep when the sex started)
Post #1040133
solaris
10/13/2017     
Member with the lack of evidence boiling it down to you said-she said, i'd probably do exactly the same thing. very different situation to the predatory actions of weinstein.
given what else you have been through, and your empathy towards others, hopefully she's unlikely to repeat what happened, and it wasn't exactly a power-play thing, reality tends to say you have to chalk it up to experience.

you explored your options and came to a decision. now you can move forward.
Post #1040134 Back to top ▲
10/13/2017
  
solaris
Member
with the lack of evidence boiling it down to you said-she said, i'd probably do exactly the same thing. very different situation to the predatory actions of weinstein.
given what else you have been through, and your empathy towards others, hopefully she's unlikely to repeat what happened, and it wasn't exactly a power-play thing, reality tends to say you have to chalk it up to experience.

you explored your options and came to a decision. now you can move forward.
Post #1040134
solaris
10/13/2017     
Member with the lack of evidence boiling it down to you said-she said, i'd probably do exactly the same thing. very different situation to the predatory actions of weinstein.
given what else you have been through, and your empathy towards others, hopefully she's unlikely to repeat what happened, and it wasn't exactly a power-play thing, reality tends to say you have to chalk it up to experience.

you explored your options and came to a decision. now you can move forward.
Post #1040135 Back to top ▲
10/13/2017
  
solaris
Member
with the lack of evidence boiling it down to you said-she said, i'd probably do exactly the same thing. very different situation to the predatory actions of weinstein.
given what else you have been through, and your empathy towards others, hopefully she's unlikely to repeat what happened, and it wasn't exactly a power-play thing, reality tends to say you have to chalk it up to experience.

you explored your options and came to a decision. now you can move forward.
Post #1040135
Jelly
2 days ago @ 1:49 PM     
Member I understand the silence, and being a survivor myself, I very much understand and sympathize with all victim's choice to report or not. In the Weinstein case, the stakes were so high and I cannot imagine what it felt like for these women. All I can say is that I'm proud that they are shining huge spotlights on the case now, and that Rose McGowan is my hero. Terry Crews and James Van der Beek, too. Well, everyone who has bravely spoken out. And, my heart is also with those too scared to take their situations public.
Post #1040172 Back to top ▲
2 days ago @ 1:49 PM
  
Jelly
Member
I understand the silence, and being a survivor myself, I very much understand and sympathize with all victim's choice to report or not. In the Weinstein case, the stakes were so high and I cannot imagine what it felt like for these women. All I can say is that I'm proud that they are shining huge spotlights on the case now, and that Rose McGowan is my hero. Terry Crews and James Van der Beek, too. Well, everyone who has bravely spoken out. And, my heart is also with those too scared to take their situations public.
Post #1040172
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